moving starting town to port joesph

[Mith]

lvl 3-5 is quite a lot. I usually run straight to the newbie tower when i start a new char (without donating any stuff at all) and kill everything that moves. After leaving the newbie tower, i'm lvl 3. Then i go to port joseph to find myself a mithril chainmail. Wen i've that, i'm about lvl 5 and usually i've found a pretty weapon.
Next thing to do are the first two royalty quests blah blah.
Is there any reason i write this? Well, the only reason is that I think Scorn is also suitable for lvl 1 players.

I think Cavesomething wanted to use Porth Joseph because he has to use _some_ location. Porth Joseph /as is/ is not suitable as a starting area. Both too high lvl and too small.

Brest as an option for Nexus is... well... i think it is not suitable. Brest is an area one cannot enter or leave below some lvl. (the signs say (still?) 15, but i think it should be much higher, a lvl 15 cannot kill direwolfs). Besides, Brest is a place a lvl 5 char cannot survive. I think Wolfsburg would be a better starting place, though it still is a too high lvl area. That's why i'm not fond of other starting locations.

Oh, no matter what you do, my main char will never leave scorn. Scorn is fun, there are the most players around, Scorn appartment contains ALL my stuff etc. Has not much to do with high lvl area's

[cavesomething]

lvl 3-5 is quite a lot.

I agree, I don't think it should be possible to be reaching level 5 from playing tutorial maps, possibly level 2, if it is cleared completely.

I think Cavesomething wanted to use Porth Joseph because he has to use _some_ location. Porth Joseph /as is/ is not suitable as a starting area. Both too high lvl and too small.

Correct, as I see it at the moment Port joesph has high level maps, but they are all part of one quest, they could move out, and then there is enough space for beginners1 &2, the fun house, and barking mule or goth's tavern to move there.

Oh, no matter what you do, my main char will never leave scorn. Scorn is fun, there are the most players around, Scorn appartment contains ALL my stuff etc. Has not much to do with high lvl area's

Wait 'til I nerf all the shops there, you'll have to move eventually.

Removing the alchemy ingredients tables might help too (personally I think they shouldn't exist at all, and that the ingredients should be mined, from locations around the world map.)

[poof]

Correct, as I see it at the moment Port joesph has high level maps, but they are all part of one quest, they could move out, and then there is enough space for beginners1 &2, the fun house, and barking mule or goth's tavern to move there. [...] Wait 'til I nerf all the shops there, you'll have to move eventually.

In that case, why have Scorn at all? You are considering moving things that I see as making Scorn unique. Taking this further, a town without shops might as well not exist in Crossfire. As far as moving two beginners houses that is not bothering me, the other "stuff" is.

Removing the alchemy ingredients tables might help too (personally I think they shouldn't exist at all, and that the ingredients should be mined, from locations around the world map.)

Hmmm, maybe this should be discussed on the mapping mailing list. The changes you want to make are non-trivial changes to the maps. I do not understand why there is a problem with Scorn being the most occupied place in the crossfire world. If players gravitate there then we should use that instead of trying to control it. Posit your ideas on the mapping mailing list and let's get other mappers and developers involved.

[Mith]

lvl 3-5 is quite a lot.

I agree, I don't think it should be possible to be reaching level 5 from playing tutorial maps, possibly level 2, if it is cleared completely.

[/quote]
Ay, my concern rather was that lvl 3-5 is quite a lot to be allowed to leave the newbie-world, not that it is too high in lvl to enter the real world

Correct, as I see it at the moment Port joesph has high level maps, but they are all part of one quest, they could move out, and then there is enough space for beginners1 &2, the fun house, and barking mule or goth's tavern to move there.

The quests are not that high lvl. iirc 15 is (more than) sufficient, and iirc scorn aims at players lvl 1-15.
If you'd ask me, it's fine to have some quests in Scorn

Wait 'til I nerf all the shops there, you'll have to move eventually.

not if you don't move my appt ...

I really do not understand why you want all the high lvls out of Scorn. It is very fruitful for newbs to have some high lvls around actually. As i see the game, player interaction, also between high and low lvl players, is a part of the game, a part that would be destroyed once all high lvl players are 'out of scorn'

actually, i don't understand why you're want to increase distance by nerfing WoR and Town Portal, removing teleporters and such. The only reason i never go to Navar is that involves too much walking/buying tickets etc.

[cavesomething]

Wait 'til I nerf all the shops there, you'll have to move eventually.

In that case, why have Scorn at all? You are considering moving things that I see as making Scorn unique. Taking this further, a town without shops might as well not exist in Crossfire. As far as moving two beginners houses that is not bothering me, the other "stuff" is.

I don't want a town without shops, but merely one that has shops that will be far less useful to higher level players, so that those wanting to sell things will go elsewhere to do so, and hopefully spend more time there.

Removing the alchemy ingredients tables might help too (personally I think they shouldn't exist at all, and that the ingredients should be mined, from locations around the world map.)

Hmmm, maybe this should be discussed on the mapping mailing list. The changes you want to make are non-trivial changes to the maps. I do not understand why there is a problem with Scorn being the most occupied place in the crossfire world. If players gravitate there then we should use that instead of trying to control it.

The problem with that is that it reduces the effective size of the game world. Its all very well to have 3000-odd maps, but if only 100 are ever used, the rest might as well not exist.

The thing I mentioned about alchemy tables is more of a throwaway comment, though it is how (as I understand it) runescape deals with crafting.

From memory how it works is:
There are serveral types of resource that are 'mined' by using a pick on the rocks that contain them. These rocks yield one unit from being mined, then they can't be mined again until they regenerate, how long that takes depends on the number of players on the server.

It is worth considering whether that would be a more stable way to keep the economy under control.

[Mith]

I do not understand why there is a problem with Scorn being the most occupied place in the crossfire world. If players gravitate there then we should use that instead of trying to control it.

The problem with that is that it reduces the effective size of the game world. Its all very well to have 3000-odd maps, but if only 100 are ever used, the rest might as well not exist.

I do agree with all but the fourth word in your quoted writing Cavesomething.
That problem is IMO not caused by 'everyone' living in Scorn, but by the distance between regions. If it was relative easy to go from Scorn to Navar (or from A to B), more maps would be used. Spreading players might counter the symptoms, but it does not address the real problem.

edit (after poof replied):
Think of smallworld. everything was easily reachable and... reached. For example moving from Scorn to Navar was easy (not only because the road was mostly straight...)
I think this is what one could call a proof of what i write above.

[poof]

... That problem is IMO not caused by 'everyone' living in Scorn, but by the distance between regions. If it was relative easy to go from Scorn to Navar (or from A to B), more maps would be used. Spreading players might counter the symptoms, but it does not address the real problem.

Exactly. The world needs to be easier to navigate, not more difficult. Taking this into consideration I am looking at making modified copies of the dragon hangar near or in each major town. I think buying a ticket to go somewhere is not near an onerous prospect as trying to navigate the world by walking places. If people miss certain sites because they always fly places using a dragon hangar who cares? I know I don't care. I know there are places one will need to find by walking around. If players choose to not do that who am I to try to force them to do that? However, places like Brest would not have a dragon hangar in them. I would put that dragon hangar between Brest and Lake Country. The people that want to walk around and explore will walk around and explore. The ones that don't want that hassle will just not play CF if we make it a requirement that they have to walk around the world to do anything.

I still think all of this needs discussion on the mailing list before anything is done. Except for the dragon hangars of course. I already discussed that on the mailing list a while back IIRC. =)

[Mith]

... I am looking at making modified copies of the dragon hangar near or in each major town. I think buying a ticket to go somewhere is not near an onerous prospect as trying to navigate the world by walking places. ...

How about adding a phoenix to the game. you can either buy it for a lot of diamonds or win it by killing quite a few mighty mobs.

You can tell the phoenix to bring you to worldmap abc_def and he'll bring you there, finding the nearest suitable landing place. Alternatively, you could tell him to bring you to navar/brest/any_place_he_knows_on_the_worldmap and he'll do so without hesitation (except for neurmberg and maybe some other cities)
I think the phoenix should only know the locations a player ever has been - see it as teaching the phoenix where the location is.

[Rednaxela]

Sounds like a way to get to the valley of the three sisters without spending at over 15 min =P

[Mith]

Sounds like a way to get to the valley of the three sisters without spending at over 15 min =P

yep, but only after you managed to find it at least once