Crossfire Forum

poof wrote: Some items, skills, whatnot are just superior. Thus it mirrors real life for In Real Life there is no "balance" .

But Crossfire is a game and not real life[shocked gasps all around]. In games there should be, there needs to be trade-offs that create decisions.

One of the simplest games, the prisoner's dilemma, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner%27s_dilemma illustrates this idea.

all games follow this principle to some extent. Crossfire does so far more, on many different aspects (eg 'should I kill the grim reaper or the vampire first? the vampire might kill me if I choose that second, but the grim reaper will drain me.')

poof wrote: Your brain may be superior to my brain thus you get big paychecks for your superior ideas and I do not, that is just the way it is.

wrt the sims, which implements something like this.
My knowledge skill may be higher, so I get to advance further in a career path that pays more, but have to work longer hours and get more tired, so I need to buy better quality chairs and beds to keep my comfort level up. In the short term (a few days or so), I may have /less/ money than I did, or my rate of promotion may drop (because my sim is tired and unhappy)

poof wrote: Besides, those that like to experiment and try more challenging weapon blessings will do so. Those that are lamers and always want devourer blessed weapons ... who cares what they do? I play for me, not them. =p

but where there is a rational choice for a good weapon, the only reason not to take it is to gain some other advantage, in your case bragging rights/status.

I do not consider (and judging by the number of devourour weapons in use I am not alone here) that this is sufficiant on its own...

cavesomething wrote:

poof wrote: Besides, those that like to experiment and try more challenging weapon blessings will do so. Those that are lamers and always want devourer blessed weapons ... who cares what they do? I play for me, not them. =p

but where there is a rational choice for a good weapon, the only reason not to take it is to gain some other advantage, in your case bragging rights/status.

What about Fun?

my previous post was expressed in terms of game theory, the science of taking fun things and systematically removing the 'fun'.

cavesomething wrote:my previous post was expressed in terms of game theory, the science of taking fun things and systematically removing the 'fun'.

IOW, making the games "balanced". =p

Instead of making devourer blessed weapons less desirable how about <gasp> making the other blessed weapons more desirable? There is your coveted game balance. =)

but it also:

1) makes the game easier, which means that other players will die less. (this is bad)

2) makes artifact weapons comparitively less good.

ok, 1 is subjective, but the second point stands, if the enchanted weapons are better then fewer players will use artifact weapons because they are less valuable, and the comparitive value of weapons as quest rewards is lessened.

I would think questing is something to be encouraged.

cavesomething wrote:but it also:

1) makes the game easier, which means that other players will die less. (this is bad)

2) makes artifact weapons comparitively less good.

ok, 1 is subjective, but the second point stands, if the enchanted weapons are better then fewer players will use artifact weapons because they are less valuable, and the comparitive value of weapons as quest rewards is lessened.

I would think questing is something to be encouraged.

point 2 is easy to fix: allow artifact weapons to be enchanted.

anyway, no artifact weapon can be as good as a player-enchanted weapon - except for some attack types. Nothing, i repeat, NOTHING beats an enchanted headcutter/other weapon of <some god> +15 (str+6, dex+6, con+6)
This weapon will have around +25 item power, which is less than a Katana of Masamune or a Belzebub's Sword (both +40 IP) (but it requires lvl 100 one handed weapon)

the fact that there is a 'best' weapon is a problem in itself.

There should be no 'best' weapon.

There should be weapons that are better at some things, but not others, so that a player must choose what is important, and maybe even /need/ to change weapons against some monsters (and no I don't just mean exploiting the dragonslayer of devourers trick).

Mith wrote:Nothing, i repeat, NOTHING beats an enchanted headcutter/other weapon of <some god> +15 (str+6, dex+6, con+6)

Well... it's beatable if those stat bonuses are excessive for your player (already maxed before +6), in which case, trade those bonuses for improve damage etc.

cavesomething wrote:the fact that there is a 'best' weapon is a problem in itself.

There should be no 'best' weapon.

There should be weapons that are better at some things, but not others, so that a player must choose what is important, and maybe even /need/ to change weapons against some monsters (and no I don't just mean exploiting the dragonslayer of devourers trick).

best weapon is simply the weapon that fits most cases. of course you have to change weapons some time, but a firebrand (to name one) is always useless

That is already the case. I carry about about 4 different swords that I need to use on different monsters. Also things like dagger of fortune for praying and alchemy...